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rats, seesm to have lost the ginny heinlein interview.
no, there it is. i was reading "starman jones" for about the 7th time today, so fresh heinlein gossip, whoopee.





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Heinlein Reader's Discussion Group
Saturday 06-22-2002 5:00 P.M. EDT.
Heinlein's Travels


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Here Begins The Discussion Log

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You have just entered room "Heinlein Readers Group chat."

Paradis401: I think all of Robert's books are in French.

SAcademy: What is belle about France?

AGplusone: True ... did you see the post about Twain's A Tramp Abroad, in the Tramp Royale thread Denis?

Paradis401: They like to hear you say belle about their country.

AGplusone: Twain's essay from there, entitled : "The French and the Comanches" really needs a reply . . .

AGplusone: Hi, David

DavidWrightSr: Hi lady & gents. Just checking in. won't be able to participate for a while. Got to take self & wife to get something to eat.

SAcademy: HUH!

Paradis401: No David, I've been in Limbo/transit for a couple of weeks.

SAcademy: Hello, David.

AGplusone: Ah, I'll send you a copy ... I'm going to have to type it out anyway.

Paradis401: Hi David W!

Paradis401: OK Thanks.

DavidWrightSr: HI again to everybody.

AGplusone: It's hard to find, and Twain was very hard on la belle France

Paradis401: HI mr. Wright.

KultsiKN has entered the room.

Paradis401: Twain had good reason perhaps,

KultsiKN: Hello, all!

AGplusone: Twain delighted in being outrageous!

SAcademy: Hello Kultsi!

Paradis401: Ho Kultsi!

AGplusone: Hi, Kultsi

DavidWrightSr: Be back in a while. Enjoy.

SAcademy: How is Midsummer day going for you?

AGplusone: please do, Dave

Paradis401: Twain was also a good linguist.

AGplusone: particularly with The Awful German Language?

KultsiKN: Still alive ;-) Bad weather yesterday...

AGplusone: In the same A Tramp Abroad.

SAcademy: We are having rain here.

AGplusone: Nice sunny day here.

Paradis401: Maybe David, but German is more logical than French. That's why they dislike each other. Robert was reading Verne in French, wasn't he Ginny?

siannon prime has entered the room.

AGplusone: Hi, Jani. Real LTNC

siannon prime: Hi everyone ;-)

SAcademy: Well, I did not consider his French very good. No.

KultsiKN has left the room.

Paradis401: I thought he understood it quite well and the times he used it in his writing, he never made a mistake.

AGplusone: You know Kultsi, Ginny, Dave Wright is off with his wife and will be back after they eat, Denis Paradis is in Kentucky, but is from Quebec I think . . .

Paradis401: Denis is now back in Michigan. Long story.

KultsiKN has entered the room.

Paradis401: Did we scare Kultsi off with the French?

AGplusone: That has a "long story" look to it.

mertide has entered the room.

AGplusone: wb K

KultsiKN: Damn. Got booted.

mertide: morning!

Paradis401: Yes;-)

AGplusone: Hi, Carolyn. siannon is Jani from Shropshire

mertide: THanks :-)

AGplusone: mertide, meet Jani, mertide is in Oz

Paradis401: Hi Carolyn!

mertide: Hi!

SAcademy: Hello, Carolyn.

mertide: Hello Mrs Heinlein

mertide: Nice and warm there this evening?

SAcademy: Why so formal? It's Ginny

mertide: Hello Ginny, thank you

KultsiKN: Yup, today's been all sunshine!

SAcademy: And the longest day of the year, too.

siannon prime: Yes, happy solstice, all ;-)

mertide: It's very cold this morning here, or it feels it, clear night

Paradis401: I love tonight's topic.

SAcademy: At least northern hemisphere.

mertide: Our houses are built to let heat out

KultsiKN: Yes, indeed. No night, for all practical purposes.

AGplusone: Tramp Royale ... a trip around the world.

mertide: How exciting, no night

AGplusone: Ginny, I know you and Robert visited G.Britain, Scotland in particular, right?

SAcademy: Somewthing happened with that title: when the galleys came in, I asked to have it changed to match Kipling. But that was too late.

KultsiKN: It's just past midnight, and if my eyes were as they used to be, I could read a paper out there.

Paradis401: Ginny, weren't the Heinleins the first to go through the Northwest passage as passengers?

SAcademy: Yes. It was the first ship to make it.

SAcademy: And to reach the Orient.

AGplusone: Which change would that have been? Howso?

SAcademy: change? I don't understand.

AGplusone: "when the galleys came in, I asked to have it changed to match Kipling. "

SAcademy: We were escorted to the Alaska border by a Canadian icebreaker.

SAcademy: Oh, now I know. Leave off the "E"

Paradis401: Damn French editor wanted to spell it in French instead of Royal English.

AGplusone: Ah

AGplusone: That must be a glorious route ... does it look much like Norwegian fjords in the ice ... or something entirely different?

SAcademy: Made a stop in the Pribiloffs, too. K now anyone else who has been there?

Paradis401: No. Spider?

SAcademy: Nothing like the fjords at all. It's mostly flat.

SAcademy: The North American shield.

SAcademy: In Labrador it is mountainous.

SAcademy: With glaciers.

AGplusone: Much like most of the western coast of Alaska?

AGplusone: up to Juneau?

mertide: Did you have any trouble? Get frozen in at all?

SAcademy: It was cold, but it's colder down south!

SAcademy: I heard from someone that our ship was frozen in at someplace in Antarctica.

SAcademy: Carolyn, have you ever gone down to that island to your south?

mertide: So what year would that passage have been? I don't think there are that many passenger trips doing the Passage even now?

SAcademy: I haven't heard of any.

Paradis401: 1984

mertide: No, not yet, on my list of things to do soon. A friend got dropped in the water on the transfer to the little landing boat, put me off a tad

SAcademy: Pretty cold?

mertide: More shocked she said, they pulled her straight out and got her dry ASAP

SAcademy: They have to do that. Otherwise it might have killed her.

mertide: I think so, I don't think your life expectancy would be terrific in that water for long

KultsiKN: The max is around -5 for the water -- still quite deadly for a longer exposure.

SAcademy: That is what they say. I have not fallen in.

KultsiKN: 5 minutes max, if you have good clothing.

mertide: Good on you :-)

Paradis401: Sailor's don't fall in.

Paradis401: Sailor ladies.

AGplusone: And soldiers stay in their bunks below ...

mertide: It was just bad luck apparently - a wave swell moved the lander as she was going in

KultsiKN: Nowadays the have special suits that let you float and isolate you.

AGplusone: or "in the bumboat until it's over"

SAcademy: What we wore was special stuff from Eddie Bauer.

mertide: Did the cruise line supply that or yourselves?

Paradis401: Ginny was better on top of the ice, I've heard from several sources. And cute as a princess!

SAcademy: It wasn't a real cruise ship--it was the Lindblad Explorer. She went from doing the islands of Indonesia to the far notrth and places like Resolute in Canada's islands.

mertide: You were definitely adventurous travellers then

SAcademy: sorry food just arrived. Pause while I eat it.

mertide: I prefer my ice in my glass than under ice skates

AGplusone: Kultsi: see if you can send an invitation to "Gandalara" please.

KultsiKN: Sorry, not on my buddy list :-(

KultsiKN: Is that the screen name?

AGplusone: Anyone ... ? yes.

Gandalara has entered the room.

Gandalara: Aha! I made it :-)

KultsiKN: Hah! Worked!

AGplusone: Hi, Karen ... meet folk.

Paradis401: Hi Karen.

Gandalara: I clicked on "view sender" the first time, and it disappeared and wouldn't come back.

siannon prime: Hi Karen

Gandalara: ::: waving at all the nice folks :::

mertide: On a warmer part of the world, I was struck by the pessimism on the South Africa situation and how it would resolve, compared to how it actually did in the end. Compared to how Zimbabwe is ending, which is more what was foreseen.

AGplusone: Kultsi's in Finland, mertide in Oz, Denis Paradise in Michigan,

siannon is Jani and in Shropshire, DaveWright is off having dinner w/wife and wbeback ....

KultsiKN: Hi, Karen!

AGplusone: and SA is Mrs. Heinlein, and we're talking about the Heinlein travels through the Northwest Passage, via a topic generally on Travels, including Tramp Royale

mertide: Hi Karen, I'm Carolyn when I'm not using my secret identity :-)

Gandalara: Definitely world-wide then. I'm in Southern California.

AGplusone: and I'm David or AG or once Zim

AGplusone: and I'm in the former People's Republic of Santa Monica

Gandalara: lol

AGplusone: lol

AGplusone: Karen's a sci-fi chat host from AOL

Gandalara: Well, I'll just fluff up a beanbag, and listen for awhile.

SAcademy: Back

SAcademy: Tasmania. We were there on one trip.

SAcademy: Not too many Americans get there.

SAcademy: And it was the first time I have ever seen the Tasman sea quite calm!

mertide: I was in Tasmania between age 1 and 13, it's still what I think of as home

SAcademy: I suppose that is natural.

mertide: My parents were Queenslanders, so most years we made the crossing north by ferry and drove up

mertide: and yes, it was rarely calm sailing

SAcademy: We were in Brisbane, on that trip and I met a koala named Little Mo.

mertide: One year my parents were incapacitated by sea sickness and I took full advantage and spent their money in the slot machines, I must have been 5 or 6

SAcademy: Delightful person but a heavyweight!

mertide: Lone Pine is still going, still a lovely place for visitors and locals to go

Paradis401: Wasn't Little Mo described in TR Ginny?

mertide: in the suburbs now, Brisbane has sprawl like Los Angeles

SAcademy: Yes Dennis.

SAcademy: Picture, too.

Paradis401: Thanks :-)

mertide: you were lucky, quite often you end a koala cuddle a little damper than you started

KultsiKN: Where in Tasmania did you live, Carolyn?

mertide: Hobart, and around it

mertide: We were on a farm for the last few years a little out of town

KultsiKN: The capitol -- more specific, pls...

mertide: South East

mertide: spectacular sight for a city, between a pretty harbour and a small mountain

KultsiKN: I'm cheating: http://www.wilmap.com.au/ausmaps/tasmap.html

mertide: We could go up and play in the snow every winter

mertide: Once even on Christmas Day, which isn't winter here :-)

mertide: We always used to take visitors to Port Arthur to see the convict ruins, very interesting place

SAcademy: We have something like that a bit to the south of where I now live. In Florida.

mertide: A convict settlement?

KultsiKN: Mount Nelson?

SAcademy: An old Spanish fort and they did have prisoners there.

mertide: Mount Wellington

mertide: Mount Nelson is more a big suburban hill

mertide: It's quite a self contained insular place. When we moved back to the mainland, I knew the geography of the island intimately, could have drawn you that map, but I barely knew where any of the mainland cities were

Paradis401: Did Robert ever do any writing while on your trips, Ginny? Make story notes on your famous 3x5 cards?

mertide: Only the ones we drove through going north, Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane. My father drove sunup to fall asleep

SAcademy: It seems odd to us to call Australia "the mainland."

mertide: Must be an island thing :-)

SAcademy: I think so.

mertide: It was the next thing to a foreign country anyway, an awful lot of Tasmanians never went over

SAcademy: Iloved the Sydney zoo first time I saw it.

mertide: We went last year, took the kids for the first time since they were babies, it's still beautiful, deco design

mertide: I have a thing for giraffes, I could watch them all day

Gandalara: Sigh. I'll make it to Australia when they finally get the transporters working. :-)

mertide: And you still get there on the Manly ferry :-)

SAcademy: For those who have not been there, it's on a hillside and you start at the top and walk down.

mertide: They have a cable car from the ferry to the top now, as well as buses

KultsiKN: Ginny, you ever been to the Helsinki Zoo?

mertide: We had such a lovely day, they had a free bird show with eagles who soared around the natural open amphitheatre overlooking Sydney harbour

SAcademy: No, I am afraid not.

KultsiKN: It's also on an island, with a ferry connection.

SAcademy: Sorry I missed it.

mertide: Is there anywhere you wanted to go that you didn't get to?

SAcademy: Lots of places!

KultsiKN: Well, nothing spectacular as the zoos go, but not a bad one. Your friends here prolly did not think it worth the trip.

SAcademy: It is a big planet!

mertide: Did you go to Egypt at all?

SAcademy: Yes. to Cairo and the pyramids etc.

SAcademy: But we missed the rest of N. Africa.

mertide: Was that political trouble or time pressures?

SAcademy: political troubles.

mertide: With all the travel and the building works, it seems amazing Mr Heinlein wrote anything at all!

SAcademy: Also, Robert had to get back to his typewriter to make more money for more travel.

mertide: We're very grateful he had that goad :-)

SAcademy: He wrote very fast. Turned out a book in 13 days once.

SAcademy: It is still in print--The Door Into Smmer.

mertide: 13 days for that? Wow!

SAcademy: I think it was the fastest he ever did one.

Paradis401: Robert had special inspiration. And now she's going to tell me once again that flattery will get me nowhere.

mertide: It's so long, it must have just poured from his fingers

SAcademy: Actually he was a pretty slow typist.

mertide: I can't imagine even a novella in 13 days - he must have had it in his head as a gestalt to start

SAcademy: He would start slowly each day and speed up until he had to







Paradis401: Robert had special inspiration. And now she's going to tell me once again that flattery will get me nowhere.

mertide: It's so long, it must have just poured from his fingers

SAcademy: Actually he was a pretty slow typist.

mertide: I can't imagine even a novella in 13 days - he must have had it in his head as a gestalt to start

SAcademy: He would start slowly each day and speed up until he had to sleep.

Gandalara: Door Into Summer was the first Heinlein I read.

SAcademy: I think he did have his ideas in his head before he began a book.

mertide: That one should have got a Hugo IMO

SAcademy: It began with the anecdote about our cat, Pixie. Winter night and he took me around to every door in the house--7--and I told Robert that he was looking for the door into summer. And he said "hold it" and ducked into the study and began the book.

mertide: And surfaced two weeks later? :-)

SAcademy: I read it as he went along, of course. It's somewhat my favorite.

mertide: Did it sell well immediately?

SAcademy: I can't remember that.

SAcademy: It did to the publisher.

BPRAL22169 has entered the room.

SAcademy: Hi, Bill.

KultsiKN: Hello, Bill!

mertide: Hopefully two weeks of solid work like that bought you a year of travel :-)

BPRAL22169: Hi, Ginny. Sorry to be late; I got involved writing.

mertide: Hello, Bill

BPRAL22169: I lose track of time when I start concentrating.

SAcademy: Is someone keeping a log? If so, Bill can read it.

AGplusone: I'm doing that. Bill you want a log now?

mertide: Did Robert have lots of plots and ideas running around his head all the time, or did he sit down and write after a sudden inspiration?

SAcademy: I was never sure about that.

BPRAL22169: I wouldn't have time to read it now -- unless there is something you specifically want to call my attention to.

BPRAL22169: I think the record shows he did it both ways.

AGplusone: no, we're just having fun

SAcademy: With the Man who was too lazy to fail--he had been telling that story for years so he knew it well.

AGplusone: Gandalara was one of our blood donors at Philly

SAcademy: And finally I said to him--put it in a book.

AGplusone: Karen, meet Bill, Bill: Karen

BPRAL22169: He had been working up the story that would become The Door Into Summer for some time, but it was ginny and Pixel looking for the door into summer that crystalized the writing.

Gandalara: ::: virtual handshake :::

AGplusone: She lives out by the Gardner ranch

BPRAL22169: Ok -- you, too.

BPRAL22169: Is that in Southern California? I'm a little vague on that one.

mertide: That's really interesting, was it a story he told friends as well, or just to you

AGplusone: Temecula

Gandalara: Yes - in the desert

BPRAL22169: Got it.

AGplusone: Bill's up in Santa Cruz ...

AGplusone: or near it

BPRAL22169: Santa rosa right now.

BPRAL22169: 150 miles north. Perspective does wonders.

mertide: You get that impression, that he was as much a story teller in the full sense as a "writer", someone who'd tell you a yarn on a winter night

AGplusone: I have a vision of Northern California and Los Angeles like the famous drawing on the front of New Yorker

BPRAL22169: Yes, you do. But considering how difficult they make it to get down there, I have a map writ by agony.

AGplusone: showing New York and the rest of the country, sorta out of perspective

BPRAL22169: that's a very famous New Yorker cover.

AGplusone: OI know

Paradis401: Weren't you received like royalty in Japan in 1984, Ginny?

SAcademy: For Pete's sake NO

Paradis401: OK ;-)

SAcademy: We did get to a wedding receptiion and they gave me flowers, but royalty. NO

SAcademy: Robert has a lot of readers in Japan.

mertide: In translation or English or both?

SAcademy: Both I think

SAcademy: English is a second language in most parts of the world. Lucky us.

mertide: royalties if not royalty then

SAcademy: That is more like it.

SAcademy: Ships carry copies in their libraries.

mertide: Did you ever go back to New Zealand? Friday seemed a whole lot more positive about the place than Tramp Royale.

SAcademy: Yes. But I did seldom go ashore there.

mertide: Mutton is an acquired taste :-)

SAcademy: It is. Although they send some of it here, too.

SAcademy: I have known Americans to go there --to live, they said, but mostly they come back home again.

mertide: It's popular in our Indian communities, curried mutton, the stronger flavoured the better

SAcademy: Well, it takes all sorts of tastes--

mertide: I don't think on the whole they're that laid back a people to suit Americans looking for greener pastures

KultsiKN has left the room.

KultsiKN has entered the room.

Paradis401: WB Kultsi

KultsiKN: Thx

mertide: We had very close friends in Hobart who were American, he was an abalone diver

BPRAL22169: I had a friend who emigrated to NZ in the 1980's to raise his family in a saner environment. He came back 2 years later. Couldn't take the bigotry.

mertide: Against Americans or within the country itself?

BPRAL22169: Both. The anti-american prejudice is very strong there, but anti-Maori prejudice is even stronger.

BPRAL22169: Also the beets on hamburgers had something to do with his decision to quit the country.

SAcademy: He said, picking his teeth.

BPRAL22169: LOL

Paradis401: :-D

mertide: There is nothing wrong with beets, better than pickled gherkins on burgers

mertide: :-)

BPRAL22169: In this country we have gotten ashamed of the bigotry -- it's still there but we don't use the old ways of exhibiting it. In NZ they are still in the old pre WWII mode of bigotry, unabashed.

mertide: The number of "pickles" that get picked out of McDonalds burgers here would feed a small African country

SAcademy: Should I ask which country?

siannon prime: Sorry, all, I have to go - work calls - nice to see everyone again :-)

mertide: Well, maybe a very small one, say Eritrea? :-)

siannon prime has left the room.

mertide: They sell Australian burgers here at McDonalds too, with beetroot instead of pickles

DenvToday has entered the room.

KultsiKN: Hi, Ron!

mertide: But we're weaned onto Vegemite on our teething rusks, so perhaps our tastes are slightly different

DenvToday: Greetings everybody!

DenvToday: Good to see you all.

Paradis401: Hi Ron!

BPRAL22169: Slightly. Er -- um -- yeah.

BPRAL22169: My sister emigrated to Australia and was just back in the country after 13 years. She brought a jar of Vegemite with her -- partly for her own two girls, of course, but also so we all could find out what the Aussies consider worth fighting for.

SAcademy: There was a place in Auckland where they served American hamburgers. We went there now and then.

mertide: So, go on, what did you really think of it

BPRAL22169: Oh, I've had vegemite for a long time -- I rather like it, though it's not one of my favorite things. I'd rather have anchovies.

SAcademy: Me? Or someone else.

mertide: Cooking styles are so different here now, very Asian and Mediterranean influenced

BPRAL22169: that's the "fusion" trend -- it's taken over everything in the US too.

BPRAL22169: Mostly it produces just odd combinations.

Paradis401: Did they starve you in Auckland, Ginny?

mertide: My mother had a repertoire of chops (lamb), sausages, and rissoles (meatballs) with mashed potato and veg. EVERY NIGHT, one or the other

SAcademy: The hotel served meals at regular hours. But it wasn't pleasant

mertide: My husband's mother still serves meat 3 times a day, starting with lamb chops and fried eggs for breakfast. They're nearly 80

AGplusone: I've decided I need a G & T. Brb

SAcademy: That should take the mutton taste away!

mertide: Plain cooking can sometimes be a touch too plain, especially if there's no care taken

mertide: It's a great start to the morning when you have morning sickness too, I found it a terrific way to keep my pregnancy weight down was to stay with her

AGplusone: Mutton makes a nice Scots Broth ... I like it there.

BPRAL22169: It' simpossible to get mutton in this country any more.

BPRAL22169: Though lamb is quite available.

SAcademy: Ask for N. Z. lamb, Bill

BPRAL22169: Trader Joe's sells frozen frenched racks of lamb -- 8 ribs for $12 I think. Rosemary marinade. That's how common it is.

AGplusone: Yes. and they opened up a new one right next to my wife's shop

AGplusone: Yumm

BPRAL22169: Temptation. Retro me, Trader Satanas.

mertide: Holy Moley, $AU3.00 per rib?

SAcademy: And it's rancid by the time it gets here!

mertide: Our meat prices have gone up, but they'd need to provide the entertainment for the meal at that price

BPRAL22169: Is the $Aus running at $US 0.50 now?

AGplusone: See, you have to get into the exportation of lamb, Carolyn ... that's why they marinade it.

mertide: about 57cUS today, your dollar is doing a dive at the moment

AGplusone: Actually the frozen isn't too bad.

SAcademy: It's my bedtime and I have to run. JoAnn's waiting! Nite all.

BPRAL22169: No, the Trader Joe's racks are quite acceptable.

SAcademy has left the room.

mertide: GOodnight

BPRAL22169: Have fun.

Paradis401: Nite Ginny!

KultsiKN: One fast girl...

Paradis401: Always.

Gandalara: No long good-byes, eh? :-)

Paradis401: Nope.

mertide: Does anyone want a break? I need a bucket of hot water to defrost my toes

Paradis401: Sure.

AGplusone: sure

AGplusone: back at 55 past

mertide: thanks guys

KultsiKN: If you figure out a way, I could send some of this anti-freeze...

AGplusone: I just got off the phone to andrea. She's going to pick up one of those racks and we barbecue it tonight ... in about two hours.

AGplusone: grill, actually

KultsiKN: Silver, sometimes I just plain hate ya.

AGplusone: I'm drinking a nice antifreeze too Kultsi, which is why I called Andrea and asked her to pick up that rack if they had one.

AGplusone: You gotta visit sometime, Kultsi, and really get to hate me.

Paradis401: He loves to make us drool.

AGplusone: I love food.

mertide: Just put the kettle on, Kultsi, if I start drinking antifreeze at 8.46 in the morning my liver will never recover

KultsiKN: Me too, and it loves me -- sticks around.

BPRAL22169: They are frozen, David.

BPRAL22169: They've got some nice asparagus too, both fresh and frozen.

AGplusone: Actually, what I'm tempted to do since Andrea is going to be with me in San Jose at ConJose, is rent a room that has a kitchen. I could poison everyone with my famous spaghetti sauce ... made with fire like the Black Wops we are do.

Paradis401: Rub it in, you wise guy.

Gandalara: You don't have your room yet??

BPRAL22169: Keith Kato always has a spaghetti party at worldcons.

AGplusone: "You start with olive oil and about ten cloves of garlic in an iron saucepan ...."

KultsiKN: Good start

AGplusone: Not yet. I'm looking around to see if there is a room with kitchen available. We're driving up.

AGplusone: " . . . then after translucent, you sear about five cans of paste, brown ..."

Gandalara: Better start looking. Rooms are getting hard to find

AGplusone: I sure will.

Gandalara: I'm driving up too. With 2 people that have never been to CA before. Up Hwy 1 :-)

AGplusone: "Then you brown about six million chicken wings and necks ... "

AGplusone: Then the fun starts ...

BPRAL22169: There are dozens of motels in that area.

AGplusone: maybe only five million wings

mertide: You might want to try lamb rack or fillet with Harissa and Hommous, sort of a Moroccan flavour

AGplusone: That's what I was thinking. But if we managed to rent a suite ....

AGplusone: with a kitchen.

AGplusone: They should be barbecuing tri-tip all over the valley in September

AGplusone: late August

AGplusone: How do you do that, Carolyn ... what's harissa and hommous?

BPRAL22169: They're doing that out here, now. In front of the grocery stores, believe it or not.

AGplusone: [wife probably know ... I'm dumb]

AGplusone: Chickpea paste?

BPRAL22169: Hummos is chickpea puree with lemon and garlic. Harissa is a moroccan spice. Hot, I think, though it's been awhile

AGplusone: Ah ... getting close

Gandalara: Mmmm. Anything with garlic is good.

AGplusone: You know what Cicero means?

mertide: Harissa is made with chilli, cumin, caroway and garlic

mertide: V. hot

BPRAL22169: They have a hummus dip at Trader Joe's if you want Andrea to get some of that!

BPRAL22169: It's in the refrigerated section. By the fresh asparagus, probably.

DenvToday: I eat hummus when I can't remember the lyrics.

mertide: Hummus is often served with doner kebabs, that sort of thing, lebanese food

AGplusone: Greatest orator in Rome's history: Cicero = chickpea, and put down on his family. Hi, Ron, when did you slip in.

AGplusone: a put down

DenvToday: A while ago. I've been having fun watching the conversation.

mertide: I don't know what your local name is - barbecued meat and salad in a flat bread with sauces

DenvToday: I'm getting very, very hungry now. lol

mertide: I think the greek name is xiros or giros

Gandalara: gyros!

mertide: that's the one

AGplusone: Yes on Lebanese food. We have a couple friends named Drake. Don't want to know what the full name was, but they live on hummus

mertide: a long way around for the hummous

AGplusone: and gyros

BPRAL22169: Ought to try making -- the name has slipped my mind: roasted eggplant with garlic, olive oil, and lemon juice.

mertide: chickpeas, tahini (sesame paste) lemon juice, garlic, olive oil

AGplusone: everytime we used to have a reception at the lodge, both families had their women in the kitchen making hummous and all manner of stuff the white folk never heard of, but loved.

mertide: You can sort of tell I haven't had breakfast yet

AGplusone: nor have I. Was up late last night. We're torturing ourselves, Carolyn.

mertide: They call that Imam's delight don't they Bill?

mertide: Kettle should have boiled now, I'll get a drink anyway

AGplusone: Slice the eggplant and salt it, then what?

AGplusone: grill in an iron pan?

AGplusone: When does the lemon juice go in? At the end?

AGplusone: fry, not grill

BPRAL22169: Imam Bayaldi is sliced and sauteed in olive oil. This is different -- you roast the whole eggplant, scoop out the flesh, then mix with garlic and olive oil and lemon juice.

AGplusone: Ah ... that's interesting

mertide: That gives you that smoky flavour in the eggplant roasting it whole

AGplusone: Italians, i.e., my mother, only know about sauteeing ... usually with something including a little tomato

Gandalara: If you like to cook, take a look at www.recipesource.com All parts of the world are represented. Nicely searchable too.

fgherman has entered the room.

mertide: It's amazing how fond of vegetables I am seeing my mother only knew potatos, carrots, peas and beans

fgherman: Hello all

AGplusone: Hi, Felicia, we're talking about foood, marvelous FOOD

DenvToday: To saute eggplant is a tricky thing. It can soak up oil like a sponge.

Paradis401: Hi Felicia.

DenvToday: Hello Felicia!

mertide: Hi Felicia

fgherman: Sushi is nature's perfect food

mertide: Thank goodness for non-stick frypans

DenvToday: True. You can saute eggplant with just a bit of oil...the ouside stays crisp, the inside soft.

BPRAL22169: Yeah -- that's why the priest fainted (what "Imam bayaldi" means)

mertide: We used to be able to get a lovely eggplant chutney to go with indian curries but it went off the market.

mertide: England was brilliant for Indian and Pakistani food

BPRAL22169: The name of that thing has been driving me crazy. I just remembered it: Babaganouj

mertide: You could buy them even in the major supermarkets

DenvToday: Which, of course, was Ricky Ricardo's signature song.

fgherman:

DenvToday: Sorry. I'll go skulk in the corner.

BPRAL22169: No, no, no! That was babalooganouj

BPRAL22169: I'll go sit quietly in the corner now.

DenvToday: hmmm...I think you're right Bill!

fgherman: I remember now - Baba Ganouj and Zayde Couscous

AGplusone: I want to taste Felicia's sushi ...

AGplusone: or sashimi, or ....

mertide: I love sushi

AGplusone: yakatori

fgherman: I'm still making up for lost time on anagi

AGplusone: which I think is the fruit of the gods ...

BPRAL22169: The recipe on recipesource.com wants you to add tahii to it, but I never did.

AGplusone: problem is: I can't afford the restaurants that serve it anymore.

mertide: It's really good to make sushi if you are catering a film night, it's quick and easy and really popular for a supper snack

DenvToday: I love tahini.

DenvToday: Wonderful stuff.

AGplusone: Bill: George Rule made a suggestion that we might consider. He offered his copy of Heinlein's Naval Academy speech, which we have and I mentioned Cronkite's interview, and he said, why not show it at the ConJose dinner. What say you

AGplusone: about that?

fgherman: Middle Eastern food never did anything for me

KultsiKN: The Finnish recipes on recipesource.com are not very good -- you might try the sourdough though.

AGplusone: the Apollo interview.

AGplusone: We could rent a big display TV.

BPRAL22169: I would love to do it -- but it's restricted by CBS

BPRAL22169: that reminds me -- the NorWesCon people never sent my videotape back.

AGplusone: Well, we could write and ask. It's not commercial and we're a charity. A literary society.

Gandalara: Invite a rep from CBS

fgherman: You should be able to get one-time use rights

BPRAL22169: I think the appearance at MidAmeriCon is not restricted.

AGplusone: Then call up the Con director (whatisname) and ask for it back. He's on the RFF Pac NW Yahoo group I'm on.

AGplusone: And that MidAmericaCon tape is good too.

AGplusone: Robert Griese ....

AGplusone: Want me to send him an E-Mail

AGplusone: ?

BPRAL22169: Yes, if you've got his addy handy; I've tossed all mine.

AGplusone: Karen's on the Yahoo RFF panels too

AGplusone: Okay, will do



AGplusone: Robert Griese ....

AGplusone: Want me to send him an E-Mail

AGplusone: ?

BPRAL22169: Yes, if you've got his addy handy; I've tossed all mine.

AGplusone: Karen's on the Yahoo RFF panels too

AGplusone: Okay, will do

BPRAL22169: If I can get the raw footage of that interview I did at Chicon, it might be interesting.

AGplusone: RFF = the three B's groups for suckering teachers into using Sci-Fi novels in class.

BPRAL22169: Ask Ginny before you talk to the people at CBS

AGplusone: Reading for the Future

AGplusone: Three B's : Brin Bedford and Bear

AGplusone: Okay, I will.

AGplusone: Ron, Karen is Gandalara

AGplusone: new victim, er, guest to our group

Gandalara: The newbie

DenvToday: Pleased to meet ya!

fgherman: Hi Karen

Gandalara: Same here :-)

DenvToday: I've been coming for 2 years, and I'm one of the new kids.

AGplusone: Do you read Joel Rosenberg's sci-fi, fantasy novels, Karen?

AGplusone: fgherman is a 'good friend' of Joel

fgherman: Good Friend as in married to for 23+ years

Gandalara: I have most of them, I think.

AGplusone: I was excited to notice the Locus article saying that they're all being reissued.

Gandalara: I dream about that damn dragon :-)

AGplusone: That was GOOD

fgherman: Yup. God bless Jim Baen

DenvToday: Felicia, if you've been married to him for 23 years, and you're still good friends, that is a rare and wonderful thing.

fgherman: I've got a good example. My parents have their 50th next year

DenvToday: Please offer them my congrats.

AGplusone: Well, I'm getting there. Aug 6th we make 36

fgherman: I feel like a piker

AGplusone: Andrea has evidenced one hell of a lot of patience these last 36

fgherman: We've stayed together for the children

fgherman: Neither one of us wants them.

AGplusone: LOL ... the child!

DenvToday: lol

fgherman: :-)

DenvToday: good one

Gandalara: ::: snort :::

AGplusone: Tell them about the three spices, Felicia

DavidWrightSr: AG. my 36th anniversary is August 30!!!

AGplusone: Wonderful.

fgherman: Joel's joke: he lives with 3 Spice Girls

AGplusone: You know, you could fly out to visit your son at San Jose and we'd celebrate it.

fgherman: Unfortunately they're Whining Spice, Nagging Spice and Pre-Menstrual Spice.

DavidWrightSr: I wish I could afford to, but we are saving for my other son's wedding in Feb. In Louisiana

Paradis401: Felicia!

Gandalara: LOL Felicia

AGplusone: Dave Wright is in Georgia, Karen, but his oldest son David Constantine recently moved to around Monterey

BPRAL22169: LOL

fgherman: To which my response is always, "You picked the wrong day to tell that joke."

Gandalara: David, I sure hope there isn't a test later on :-)

AGplusone: Zim expects there will be.

mertide: Open book exam hopefully

fgherman: February is a good time to be in Louisiana

fgherman: Much better than Labor Day weekend

AGplusone: We gotta get Doc Krim into these chats, one day.

DenvToday: <----waiting for Joel's appearance at the Comedy Store.

AGplusone: Krim is a Lousiana doctor on alt.fan.heinlein

Paradis401: Wasn't he supposed to host a chat with his son once?

AGplusone: Who was that. No, I think that was Tony and Merfilly

AGplusone: on Heinlein Wimmen, superbroads or stupid male fantasies.

Paradis401: I think it was Alan, now.

KultsiKN: Krin, ain't it Dave?

AGplusone: Yes, Alan and his kid. Now I remember.

AGplusone: Alan's in Boston.

AGplusone: SageMerlin@aol.com

AGplusone: and it is Krin

Paradis401: Allee samee?

KultsiKN: Nope.

AGplusone: allee samee, G.I.

AGplusone: "nope" what, Kultsi ...

Paradis401: Yeah

KultsiKN: All same, nope: Alan's Alan and prolly SageMerlin, Krin's Charles? Krin in Lousiana.

AGplusone: Ah, yes.

AGplusone: I gotta idea.

mertide: Well, share it!

Gandalara: Is it the gin talking?

Paradis401: :-$

AGplusone: Guest author. Some guy named Ian wrote a series of books about jarheads in the future. Like Tom Clancy (gin definitely talking), combined with Starship Troopers, and WEB Griffin.

Paradis401: Sounds verry interesting, Zim.

Gandalara: ::: checking data base :::

BPRAL22169 has left the room.

AGplusone: They march from the Heinlein Crater on Mars, and do Marine sort of things. We invite alt.fan.tom-clancy ....

KultsiKN: Ian M Banks?

AGplusone: and cross post the pre-chat thread.

Paradis401: Great!

AGplusone: wait one. Gotta dig up books, they're actually pretty good.

fgherman: Gotta go

fgherman: Bye

fgherman has left the room.

Paradis401: Bye Felicia.

KultsiKN: Boy! 'nutter fast girl!

AGplusone: puedonym is Ian Douglas ....

Gandalara: Ian Stuart Black?

Gandalara: Douglas: Semper Mars: Book One of the Heritage Trilogy (1998) Europa Strike (2000)

AGplusone: Semper Mars, Luna Marine, Europa Strike. ISBNs possible. He definitely is a

AGplusone: you got it Karen.

Gandalara: I love the isfdb

AGplusone: He definitely is a good author in the Tom Clancy WEB Griffin line

mertide: Worth reading then?

AGplusone: and it's scifi

AGplusone: yes!

mertide: I haven't seen them here, have to Amazon them

AGplusone: We contact him and invite him.

AGplusone: OJ III goes gonzo and shows up ... maybe we recruit a few of the Clancyites into the Society

AGplusone: cross-polanization

BPRAL22169 has entered the room.

BPRAL22169: Hi -- WAOL error; I had to reboot

AGplusone: We get the bunch of "Once a Marine, Always a Marine" group.

AGplusone: And they are decent novels.

AGplusone: And Clancy made a nice speech about RAH at the time of that Requiem.

AGplusone: Said he influenced him just as Crais did.

Gandalara: Well, it's been fun, but I have some mail and surfing to do, before the Satnight chat. It was great meeting y'all.

AGplusone: These guys really sell books

mertide: Nice to meet you too

AGplusone: You want Dave to add you to the list, Karen?

Gandalara: It's done, David.

mertide: Gee that yellow font is hard to read though

AGplusone: Good

DenvToday: Take care :-)

Gandalara: Later!

Gandalara has left the room.

AGplusone: Nice to have you.

mertide: Do we have a topic for next time?

DavidWrightSr: I just came across a Heinlein reference in Alan Steele's 'Clarke County, Space'

mertide: I've never seen that one either, so ignorant

AGplusone: No. we don't and it might take me a while to line up "Ian Douglas"

mertide: It's amazing how little US sci-fi actually made it into the Oz market while the British publishers had a monopoly here

AGplusone: What suggestions for next time: I'm open to anything under the whole canopy of Heaven.

BPRAL22169: I believe the next would fall right on the Westercon weekend -- why don't we put it off and have a short vacation?

DavidWrightSr: Sound's good to me.

mertide: The DOor into summer got a bit of a run today, have you done it recently?

DavidWrightSr: Let me check the archives

mertide: I'd like at some point to talk about Heinlein's politics, esp Take back your government, but 2 books in a row no-one's read is a bit much :-)

Paradis401: Maybe we should continue the Heinlein Travels. Ginny should still have a lot to tell us about.

DenvToday: Tramp Royale?

mertide: If she's game, I'm happy to sit at her feet and listen to travel stories all day

Paradis401: Yeah. Still lots to cover.

mertide: There were more round the world trips we don't know about

DavidWrightSr: I don't see anything for the last year or so. I'd not mind hearing much more about the travel.

KultsiKN: Ginny's been to Finland four times, didya know?

Paradis401: Maybe get a bigger crowd the third time around.

DavidWrightSr: except that she has trouble staying up for the Thursday meetings

mertide: NO I didn't, she must love that cold weather. Brrr

Paradis401: Yes, so make it the Following Saturday.

KultsiKN: 25 C cold?

DavidWrightSr: Remember that's 9:00 to 12:00 midnight

DavidWrightSr: for her

mertide: or 7am-10 am Sunday Australian EST

DavidWrightSr: same as for me, but I am relatively younger :-)

BPRAL22169: Why not do something a little different for us: favorite stories

BPRAL22169: A book-chat kind of thing.

DavidWrightSr: How do you mean Bill?

DavidWrightSr: You mean Non-Heinlein favorites?

KultsiKN: THIS is my favorite, and why I find it so?

BPRAL22169: Everybody who comes be prepared to talk about their favorite Heinlein stories. That's all -- very simple, no preparation.

BPRAL22169: Yes -- an ordinary booklover's readers chat.

DavidWrightSr: I'd love it, except I have trouble figuring out which is my favorite :-)

BPRAL22169: I think we would have to place a limit of no more than, say, eight per person!

BPRAL22169: But this is actually two or three -- another chat could be favorite books, and a third could be favorite non-fiction.

DavidWrightSr: I could probably narrow it down to 8 :'(

mertide: Favourite short stories then?

Paradis401: Sorry Carolyn, we got outflanked. I tried.

mertide: never mind :-)

Paradis401: >:o

mertide: I could probably get it down to eight :-)

BPRAL22169: I don't have any essential objections to continuing with the travels -- this idea just occurred to me.

KultsiKN: Not bad, Bill -- would be nice to see what else people like.

DavidWrightSr: With the right books or stories mentioned when Ginny is present might get her to talk more about travels O:-) O:-) O:-)

Paradis401: You are sneaky, David W. :-D

BPRAL22169: Now, there's a one-track mind!

DavidWrightSr: Nah.

BPRAL22169: Unfortunately, I think most of the short stories were written before they had done any traveling.

mertide: Anything that'll get her talking would be good, anyone know what inspires her most?

BPRAL22169: The exception I can think of is "The Menace from Earth."

DavidWrightSr: I like the idea of favorites. Might be interesting to see reactions on a.f.h.

BPRAL22169: True. We might get more participation from afh.

BPRAL22169: "AFH gets cozy"

mertide: :D

DavidWrightSr: Of course, each suggestion might elicit some adverse reactions, but *some* of them might be worth listening to. others maybe not.

mertide: How many short stories are there? ANyone know off the top of your head?

DavidWrightSr: bookoodles

DavidWrightSr: (that's a favorite word of my wife's)

AGplusone: Btw, George Rule is pitching a deal.

mertide: please translate?

AGplusone: His wife Deb has a website. on Heinlein.

AGplusone: pretty good one, and tryng to get an introductionto every Heinlein story for internet readers.

DavidWrightSr: bookoodles= hillbilly georgia for 'lots of', probably corruption of 'beaucoup de')

AGplusone: Asking for writers.

AGplusone: Like we tried to do a long time ago with the AOL group.

BPRAL22169: David -- give them the summary I did of the first 2 dozen or so a few years back.

AGplusone: Asking for volunteers to take every story and write an essay. Like Bill did. Brief, synopsis, but then to go on from there. and tell them what they'll like about the stories.

DavidWrightSr: Jim Gifford lists 50 short stories

AGplusone: I've decided to revise my IWFNE idiocy, and give it to them.

DavidWrightSr: P 17 of RAH:ARC

AGplusone: The one that says Heinlein was writing his own allegorical bio

AGplusone: Idea is to have an essay on every Heinlein work.

Paradis401: Theodora and the Monkey are asking for bookoodles of attention. Nite all, it was a fun chat.

Paradis401 has left the room.

AGplusone: It's a classy website. and I really don't care where it is, Ithink there should be a place like that on the Internet for people.

AGplusone: to see what's about Heinlein's stories.

KultsiKN: Dave, you got a URL?

BPRAL22169: Incidentally, did anyone else catch the new Showtime series yesterday?

BPRAL22169: Odyssey 5

DavidWrightSr: The one about Earth being destroyed and the crew being sent back in time

AGplusone: Yeah wait one. It's in the Heinlein ring Deb put toghether.

BPRAL22169: Yeah -- that one. It doesn't look very promising, but the pilot was well done, at least.

DavidWrightSr: I didn't realize that it was a pilot until it ended so abruptly. Got in on the middle of it.

BPRAL22169: I suspect they'll do an X Files on it -- multiple layers of conspiracy to uncover.

DavidWrightSr: I loved that part about the guy's betting on the game changing the outcome

BPRAL22169: Yes -- of course, he was a wart and deserved to lose anyway.

BPRAL22169: So, tell me, David, what kind of timeline is this set in? Hmmm?

DavidWrightSr: Asimov would call that a MNC (Minimum Necessary Change) :0

BPRAL22169: Yeah-- too bad he didn't know about Sensitivity to Initial Conditions when he wrote END OF ETERNITY.

DavidWrightSr: Definitely a changeable one with overtones of Dunne's mind transfer as in Piper's Time and Again

AGplusone: Her website is http://www.dahoudek.com/heinlein/index.html

KultsiKN: Thx, Dave!

AGplusone: but his post soliciting the reviews is on sff.net

DavidWrightSr: Ask him or her to let you post it on afh

DavidWrightSr: " Sensitivity to Initial Conditions" as in 'Butterfly effect'?

AGplusone: I will. doesn't matter to me when the eventual website is

BPRAL22169: Yes, the very same.

DavidWrightSr: Ah, but that's all taken care of in his 'extensive mathematical analyses' of the Realities :-)

AGplusone: Post is on sff.discuss.heinlein-forum on sff.net

AGplusone: If you can find it.

BPRAL22169: Ah, yes -- handwaving of the highest order.

DavidWrightSr: Of course :-)

BPRAL22169: Actually, the point of that is, you can't mathematically analyze it because it emerges as it's created.

AGplusone: Rule is a sensible guy. Wrote a nice comparison of the 61 and 92 Strange in a Strange Land

BPRAL22169: Nyah, nyah, nyah-nyah.

AGplusone: 91 Stranger

KultsiKN: I haven't gotten anything on sff for _ages_

DavidWrightSr: It's a very low traffic ng

DavidWrightSr: So how are we going to do this next discussion. Should we all post a short mention of our favorites on a.f.h. Does anyone want to do a leadoff?

AGplusone: That's the problem, they've been around since '91, and they are tired.

AGplusone: Or, "been there, done that, wore out the teeshirt" and need a little revitatization.

mertide: Would it be better to leave it a while if we're putting off the discussion for a month so it doesn't get stale

BPRAL22169: Maybe -- maybe not. We may get a lot more participation.

BPRAL22169: Yeah -- I've seen that attitude, but it's not very realistic. There is an awful lot of new stuff coming out.

BPRAL22169: There are t-shirts yet to be worn out.

AGplusone: Have we decided to bail on 4th of July weekend? Why not have a bunch of us, talk about recruitment that weekend.

BPRAL22169: I won't have my computer with me, so I wont' be in on it, but I certainly have no objections.

mertide: OK with me, it's not likely to be much happening here that weekend :-)

AGplusone: About having us, each of us, get together, and bring new converts into the fold.

KultsiKN: That weekend ain't got no special meaning to me :-D Might as well chat.

mertide: Bring a new reader or you're not allowed in? :-)

AGplusone: or, of course, we could also exchange recipes

AGplusone: Exactly, and, of course, you

AGplusone: are allowed to.

mertide: ah, recipes :-)

DavidWrightSr: So. Informal meeting on the 4th weekend about recruitment and next after that on 18th and 20th about favorite short stories.

mertide: sounds good

DavidWrightSr: Are we agreed on that?

AGplusone: As I brought in Karen today

AGplusone: Okay

KultsiKN: Yea by me.

BPRAL22169: Have fun, y'all -- "Keep watching the skies"

mertide: OK by me too

BPRAL22169: "From the rocket fields of the Academy

BPRAL22169: To the Far Flung Fields of Outer space..."

mertide: Enjoy the 4th, those of you celebrating it !

DavidWrightSr: About Skies, did anybody download that program on astronomy besides myself

AGplusone: You have all the log, Dave?

DavidWrightSr: Got it all.

BPRAL22169: g'night all.

AGplusone: I couldn't. Not Mac.

BPRAL22169 has left the room.

DavidWrightSr: Night Bill.

mertide: Night all

KultsiKN: Funny -- today I was speculating: what if there's a meteoric hit close by...

DavidWrightSr: It's really neat. I found the location of the Apollo 15 landing from lat. and long. that Carolyn gave me.

mertide: bad luck to hit you, small target :-)

AGplusone: Then, preparatory to that wonderful rack of lamb I

KultsiKN: Getting larger at the equator... ;-)

AGplusone: am about to cook, I'll say:

AGplusone: Good night from New York, David.

mertide: Specially if we keep eating like this :-)

DavidWrightSr: Good Night Chet. Don't eat too much,remember your waistline :-)

AGplusone: Unless I eat a lot of hummus

KultsiKN: LOL Nite all!

mertide: Nite!

DavidWrightSr: Well, everyone. I am going to close the log. Sorry I missed most of the meeting. I'll be interested in seeing what you all had to say.

KultsiKN has left the room.

AGplusone: I think we all love food. Drop bye, it would be fun.

mertide has left the room.

DavidWrightSr: Log Officially close at 8:23 P.M. EDT


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